Mystery Babylon in Revelation. Who are the three main candidates?
Who, what or where is Mystery Babylon that was mentioned by St John the Divine in the Book of Revelation Prophecy nearly 2000 years ago? There are many candidates for the title of Mystery Babylon but the main three that come up time and time again and seem to stand the test of time are:
1. Rome, Italy and The Vatican and the Roman Catholic Church
2. Mecca, Saudi Arabia and Islam
3. New York or Washington DC or even maybe LA and/or the US/America.
There is a fourth which is quoted by many and that is Jerusalem and Israel, but this is not up for consideration at this time. The three that will be focused on are the three most consistently popular theories out there that are backed by scripture in various shapes or forms and to varying degrees. These three possiiblities for Mystery Babylon are very different animals indeed, that appear in vastly different locations and embracing totally different cultures. This is yet another topic that results in some extremely heated debate, but which one of these three is it and does the Book of Revelation scripture and Prophecy contain the key to narrow it down very clearly to just one candidate?
This article is a follow on from two previous articles that looked at Who or What Mystery Babylon is.The main body of the research is contained in the video from The Twelve Gates You Tube Channel which appears at the foot and end of this article.
Where Mystery Babylon appears in Scripture.
Mystery Babylon is mentioned in the Book of Revelation in Chapters 17 and 18 and the beginning of Chapter 19, so quite a large portion of Revelation Prophecy is tied up with this entity, which tends to suggest that it is of some significant importance in the Revelation timeline.
Who or What or Where is Mystery Babylon.
The scripture of Revelation makes it quite clear that Mystery Babylon is initially depicted as a woman in the form of a Harlot that rides "The Beast", and the Beast and this Harlot seem to be closely linked. The mention of Mystery Babylon and it's status as a woman is merely symbolic in the earlier stages of the relevant Chapters and is explained in greater detail as the scripture progresses. It is made quite clear that it is not a Woman or even a person, but a location and more to the point a city mentioned as a "Great City". It is also possibly an organisation, establishment or institution or something with religious connotations that is instantly recognised around the world.
The What is Mystery Babylon is the easy part of the puzzle to solve as it is mentioned quite clearly in Revelation Scripture but it is the What and Where is where things are not so clear and where the heated debate starts.
What is Mystery Babylon Bible Verses
These are the verses that clearly state WHAT Mystery Babylon is and a clue is given to where this entity is located. This city has dealings with many nations and the city is located on or near "Seven Mountains" which in some versions of the Bible is mentioned as "Seven Hills"
Rev 17.1 And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgement of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters
Rev 17.9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman sitteth.
Rev 17.15 And he saith unto me, The Waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues
What role does Mystery Babylon play in the End Times?
Mystery Babylon plays quite a significant role in End Times Prophecy as it has a devastating effect on Christians as mentioned in the following two verses
Rev 17:6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.
Rev 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.
What are Christians advised to do with regard to Mystery Babylon?
It is made very clear above that Mystery Babylon is an adversary to Christians and "The Church" mentioned in the New Testament many times. So much so that anybody that is part of this Mystery Babylon in any shape or form are advised strongly to leave, otherwise you will be subjected to the same judgement as Mystery Babylon itself. This is a strong indicator that Mystery Babylon could be a False Church which would rule out Islam and Mecca as one of the candidates for Mystery Babylon. As is revealed in the video though, Mecca ticks many boxes in the prophecy contained in Revelation including some interesting cross references, so things are not so clear cut.
Rev 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues
The video below from The Twelve Gates You Tube Channel doesn't claim to have the definitive answer, but it does attempt to make things clearer who this mysterious "Mystery Babylon" is? It really is narrowed down to just two candidates!
20 key Bible verses in the Book of Revelation reveal Mystery Babylon is either Rome, Mecca or the US. An in depth study to try to solve the Mystery Babylon puzzle to see who, what and where is Mystery Babylon mentioned in the Bible Prophecy contained in the Book of Revelation. What role does Mystery Babylon play in End Times Prophecy and why it is of significant importance in the Revelation Timeline.
Mystery Babylon. Where is it, what is it and the importance of this in the Book of Revelation and End Times Prophecy.
There are many theories as to what the Mystery Babylon or Mystery Babylon the Great mentioned in Revelation 17 and 18 in great detail is and what it represent. This article will narrow down what Mystery Babylon is in our modern times, why it is mentioned as a "Mystery" and the three prime candidates that fit most accurately the quite detailed description of who, what and where this place is.u
The three prime suspects are as follows:
1. Rome or more precisely The Vatican and The Roman Catholic Church.
2. America or more precisely New York
3. Saudi Arabia or more precisely Mecca and Islam
Istanbul in Turkey has been mentioned as another possibility, the original Babylon in Iraq, Europe and even London are others. These have not been looked into here but it has been mentioned many times by many people that Turkey has a role to play in the unfolding end times scenario and is always watched closely and cannot be ignored. Recent events unfolding confirm that fact. Some say it will be the seat of Satan in the End Times.
This is not a Prophetic article it´s just a demonstration that all of God´s plans are contained in the word. Only God has the whole picture. We just get the jigsaw puzzle and have to fit the pieces together via what is contained in the Bible. It´s just knowing where to look......but it is there, it just seems to reveal itself to people that have the understanding of how God works. This article ties in with The Rapture and the Tribulation article as Mystery Babylon is a key component within the forthcoming Tribulation time frame.
Everything about Mystery Babylon is contained in Revelation 17 and Revelation 18 and the detail is quite frightening in places as in it´s . If you cross reference from a hard copy KJV Bible from these two chapters you will be led to mainly two books. The Book of Isaiah and Jeremiah tie up closely with Revelation and many cross references reference those two books by these two Major Prophets from the Old Testament. Genesis also comes up on occasion especially with specific reference to Sodom and Gomorrah, which means this Mystery Babylon has similarities and will be judged accordingly. The cross references strongly suggest this!
When doing these Bible studies to see whether Rome, New York or any other city in the US and Mecca fit the bill....everything must align with the word...everything. Just having a theory and pulling out Bible Quotes to support that theory may seem convincing, BUT do ALL the jigsaw pieces fit?
The way this research was approached was via videos that each were convinced that their particular theory was correct and that it just can´t be denied. Many videos were watched and just four in my personal opinion, came up with a convincing argument that Mystery Babylon was definetly and undeniably the place that they think it is.
There are many Bible quotes in reference to Mystery Babylon but I have reduced it down to 23 verses/quotes which I think are key in identifying Mystery Babylon, some are major, some are very small details. Sometimes it´s the smaller details that really nail what and who and where this Mystery Babylon really is. Some people say the Book of Revelation is full of metaphors and symbolism and is not to be taken literally. Sometimes that is true, sometimes it isn´t. In Revelation 17 and 18 anything that is a metaphor or a symbol is quite clearly explained.
Here´s the key Bible quotes that give away the identity of Mystery Babylon and narrow things down quite convincingly to the Rome (Vatican), US (New York) and Saudi Arabia (Mecca) candidates.
Revelation 17 Relevant Bible Quotes (10)
Rev 17:1. And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:
Rev 17:3. So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.
Rev 17:4. And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
Rev 17:5. And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.
Rev 17:6. And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.
Rev 17:9. And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.
Rev 17:10. And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.
Rev 17:12. And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
Rev 17:15. And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.
Rev 17:18. And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.
Revelation 18 Relevant Bible Quotes (13)
Rev 18:2. And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
Rev 18:3. For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
Rev 18:7. How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously, so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow.
Rev 18:8. Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.
Rev 18:9. And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning,
Rev 18:11. And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her; for no man buyeth their merchandise any more:
Rev 18:12. The merchandise of gold, and silver, and precious stones, and of pearls, and fine linen, and purple, and silk, and scarlet, and all thyine wood, and all manner vessels of ivory, and all manner vessels of most precious wood, and of brass, and iron, and marble,
Rev 18:13. And cinnamon, and odours, and ointments, and frankincense, and wine, and oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and beasts, and sheep, and horses, and chariots, and slaves, and souls of men.
Rev 18:17. For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off,
Rev 18:18. And cried when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, What city is like unto this great city!
Rev 18:19. And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas, that great city, wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate.
Rev 18:23. And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.
Rev 18:24. And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.
The Rome Argument
Rome in Relation to Revelation 17
Rev 17:1 It does not sit on many waters, it is not a coastal city. The nation Italy is but the Vatican is not. Rome is inland with no access to the sea.
Rev 17:3 The wilderness referred to here is desert. There are no desert regions in Italy or near the Vatican
Rev 17:4 The Pope wears Purple, Scarlet and Gold and the Golden Cup is also a Roman Catholic identifier
Rev 17:5 No reference
Rev 17:6 The blood of Martyrs and Saint The Roman Catholic Church has been responsible for many Christian deaths via the Roman Catholic Crusades and the Roman Catholic Inquisitors
Rev 17:9 Rome is the City known as the City of Seven Hills
Rev 17:10 No reference
Rev 17:12 No reference
Rev 17:15 The Vatican is not renowned as a multicultural melting pot but the Roman Catholic Church does have many peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues
Rev 17:18 The Roman Catholic Church is a Mariana (Mary the Mother of God) based religion which would fit The Woman. Are the world leaders answerable to the Pope in finality is another question.
Rome in Relation to Revelation 18
Rev 18:2-3 The nations have drunk of the wine of her fornication could refer to the Catholic Eucharist. The Kings of te Earth have committed fornication with her just doesn´t fit. Merchants of the earth rich via her delicacies. No convincing argument there either except for materials for church idols and worship.
Rev 18:7. The Roman Catholic Church has glorfied itself and the Pope is more a Celebrity figure than other Church leaders.
Rev 18:8-11 No reference
Rev 18:12-13 Some of the merchandise listed does appear at the Vatican and in Catholic Churches around the globe but beasts, and sheep, and horses, and chariots. Slaves historically but not in these modern times. Souls of men you could argue is very relevant but not exactly a precise fit overall.
Rev 18:17. Rome and the Vatican has nothing to do with shipmasters, and ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea.
Rev 18:18 Why would the Vatican be burned to the ground?
Rev 18:19 "And they cast dust on their heads". This is not an Italian or even Vatican or Roman Catholic Custom
Rev 18:23 Catholicism is renowned for burning of candles in it´s Churches and weddings take place in Catholic churches with a bridegroom and a bride. The pieces do fit here.
Rev 18:24 Mention again of the Blood of Saints and Prophets which the Roman Catholic Church is guilty of in it´s past
The Rome Video
The America Argument
New York and America in Relation to Revelation 17
Rev 17:1 America sits on many waters, The Great Lakes, The Atlantic Ocean, The Pacific Ocean and The Gulf of Mexico. The Great Whore could be in reference to the Statue of Liberty which is based on the Goddess of Ishtar which is the goddess of fertility, love, war, and sex.
Rev 17:3 America has Desert but it is to the West. New York has no wilderness or desert where the Statue of Liberty is based.
Rev 17:4 The Statue of Liberty is Jade Green and is not dressed in Purple and Scarlet, she has something in her hand but it is not a Golden Cup but a Flaming Torch or representation off it.
Rev 17:5 The Statue of Liberty has no writing on her forehead
Rev 17:6 America is a predominantly Christian Nation and has not been responsible for the death of Christian Prophets, Martyrs and Saints.That´s unless it is the Secret sponsor of ISIS?
Rev 17:9 The woman sitteth on Seven Mountains. New York does not sit on Seven Mountains, America does not sit on Seven Mountains it sits on hundreds of mountains. The video following this states the Seven Mountains are Seven Continents which the US has control over. Form your own opinion.
Rev 17:10 Some say the Seven Kings are the Seven Presidents of the United States,the last being the present President in Office. Form your own opinion.
Rev 17:12 No reference
Rev 17:15 The waters are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues. Yes America and New York in particular is a nation/city of peoples, multitudes, nations and tongues as in multicultural.
Rev 17:18 The woman as in the Statue of Liberty the first thing you see when entering the US from the East and representation of that Nation is the current World No1 and Superpower and in effect rules over the other Kings (Presidents) via the US Dollar and superior military firepower and technology.
New York and America in Relation to Revelation 18
Rev 18:2-3 All the nations have drunk of the wine of her fornication. This could be applied o the US with it´s liberal views and Westernised society that has spread throughout the world, with Hollywood Films and Pornography dominating their respective markets along with Technology.
Rev 18:7 America has cartainly glorified itself and been proud in it´s history which is lately turning to arrogrance in it´s latter days.
Rev 18:8-11 No reference but if the US were to collapse it would cause major disruption to trade around the globe.
Rev 18:12-13 Some of the items in this merchandise list may be applicable to America but importation of food as suggested by this Bible verse just doesn´t fit whatsoever. The argument that the prophecy is an old one and these are the goods that they had in those times does not hold either. Spices could be equated to drugs but if the Bible mentions Spices....then it is Spices.
Rev 18:17 And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off. This isvery relevant to America with it´s many seaports and New York in particular is a busy Seaport.
Rev 18:18 The destruction mentioned here and mention of a Great City again ties in with New York but loosely.
Rev 18:19 And they cast dust on their heads. This is a very small detail but a major one in the Revelation prophecy. In the US (as far as I´m aware) it is not a national custom to "cast dust on their heads" in anguish. A small point but a major one and another jigsaw puzzle piece that doesn´t fit.
The America Video
The Saudi Arabia - Mecca Argument
Mecca and Islam in Relation to Revelation 17
Rev 17:1 Mecca, Saudi Arabia and the Arabian Peninsular sits on many waters including the Persian Gulf on the northeast, the Strait of Hormuz and the Gulf of Oman on the east, the Arabian Sea on the southeast and south, the Gulf of Aden on the south and the Bab-el-Mandeb strait.
Rev 17:3 Mecca and Saudi Arabia are predominantly wilderness or desert and dust.
Rev 17:4 The woman decked in scarlet and purple and decked with precious stones could represent the wealth of Saudi Arabia.
Rev 17:5 No reference
Rev 17:6 Blood of Saints and Martyrs. Recent news headlines confirm that many Christians are being killed or beheaded or persecuted by extreme and radical Islam such as ISIS
Rev 17:9 Mecca the capital of Saudi Arabia sits on seven hills
Rev 17:10 No real reference but the country of Saudi Arabia is not run by a President but by Royalty and a King
Rev 17:12 No reference
Rev 17:15 The waters are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues. Saudia Arabia is 90% Arabic and 10% Afro/Asian. It is not a multicultural country. It does serve multitudes of nations, tongues and peoples via it´s world leading oil production.
Rev 17:18 "Is that great city that reigneth over the Kings of the Earth" Saudi Arabia is the 2nd largest oil producer in the world with the US only recently claiming the No1 spot due to it´s newly found shale oil and gas exploration. Islam isthe worldssecond religion and rising fast only Christianity is bigger. The Islam religion and capital of the Islamic faith is Mecca
The Saudi Arabia Video 1
Mecca and Islam in Relation to Revelation 18
Rev 18:2-3 For all nations have drunk of her wine: The wine of Saudi Arabia has just got be OIL. Kings of the Earth have committed fornication: Prominent World leaders have ensured Saudi Arabia is protected because of the resources she has. The merchants of theearth are waxed rich: Saudi Arabia is a net importer of food, goods, spices, vehicles, gold etc.
Rev 18:7 Saudi Arabia has certainly glorified itself amongst the nations especially amongst it´s other Middle Eastern counterparts and proud of it´s powerful relations with the West.
Rev 18:9 "when they shall see the smoke of her burning". If Arabia was to experience agreat fire as mentioned in Revelation then there would be much burning and vast amounts of smoke due to the oil reserves that she has and the oil dependent West would sorely miss those supplies.
Rev 18:11 "And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her; for no man buyeth their merchandise any more". Saudi Arabia is a net importer of Food and Goods as it has limited means of production. It imports around 80% and produces 20% locally.
Rev 18:12-13 All the merchandise mentioned in these two verses are very relevant to Saudi Arabia. Replace Chariots with cars and slaves with cheap imported labour from Africa and Asia working in horrific conditions on building sites and other jobs that Saudi´s do not want to do and this is a best fit of the three
Rev 18:17 "And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off" Most of the trade for Saudi arabia arrives viaseaports such as Jeddah which serves Mecca.
Rev 18:18 If Saudi Arabia was to burn, it would burn for some time with much smoke due to it´s extensive oil reseves.
Rev 18:19 "And they cast dust on their heads". This custom does not fit the New York US argument or even the Rome argument. What society casts dust on their heads and what country has plenty of dust? The Middle East. It´s an old Judaism custom and a symbol of mourning and is still practiced today by Islam although not as much as in the days of old.
Rev 18:23 Can´t see any fit in relation to Mecca or Saudi Arabia. Possibly Islam with the Sorcery as Islam is a Baal Worship based religion.
Rev 18:24 See Rev 17:6. Same reasons
Extra Cross References:
In my KJV Bible there is a reference to Isaiah 34.10 and the verse before it as in 34:9 explains it further and gives in my opinion further confirmation.
9. And the streams thereof shall be turned into pitch, and the dust thereof into brimstone, and the land thereof shall become burning pitch.
10. It shall not be quenched night nor day; the smoke thereof shall go up for ever: from generation to generation it shall lie waste; none shall pass through it for ever and ever.
Pitch produced from plants is also known as resin. Pitch in it´s other various forms may also be called tar, bitumen or asphalt. These are derivatives made from OIL
Saudi Arabia and Mecca Video 2
This is an extremely quick skim on how I look at the Prophecy in relation and how it fits in with our modern times. Mystery Babylon is a reference to a New Babylon that has yet to come (based at the time of the prophecy writings). Rome was around in Biblical Times but New York and America were not and the Religion Islam came after Christianity (about 600 years) which would also earn it a Mystery tag.
Each one of the four videos gives a convincing argument that makes you believe that particular theory is the best fit when viewed in isolation, but when viewed one after the other, the theories do not seem so clear cut. For me personally Mecca, Islam and Saudi Arabia tops the list, the pieces just seem to fit. New York and America a close second and Rome and The Vatican and the Catholic Church a close third. All 3 are inter connected in some way and in reality the best option is to watch all 3 closely for developments. For example the Pope visited the US for the first time on 23 September 2015 which gives strength to the Rome and US argument, but again always follow the scripture.
Finally what ultimately swayed my decision is to always remember, keep your eyes on the following areas in this order Jerusalem, Israel, and the Middle East. Most of Revelations is centred around those areas and Yes America, Russia and China are powerful but they are I think 3 of the Ten kings mentioned in Rev 17:12. The world could be divided into 10 kingdoms prior to the establishment of the New World Order One World Government.
Still not convinced Saudi Arabia is the Mystery Babylon. Watch this last video
Up and coming Celebrity Pastor or Mega Preacher causing a stir, Carl Lentz of the incredibly popular and famous Hillsong Church founded by Brian Houston and his wife in Australia 30 years ago. Brian Houston is one of the biggest False Preachers from the Word of Faith Movement and the Prosperity Gospel. Carl Lentz is Head and front man for this Pentecostal denominational Church in America in New York. It has 75,000 members in twelve countries. On an average day 6,000 people attend his church which is spread over 5 services. This preacher when he is in full swing, you can see his veins popping out if his neck.
This article came about after writing a previous article on Joel Osteen which featured one video where he is being interviewed by Larry King who asks him what do you think of "Carl Lentz" and Joel Osteen replies that he is "Great" or something similar, hence the closer look. So is this one false preacher recommending another or is Carl Lentz a modern funky hip and cool version of the "Real Deal"?
Hillsong Hypocrisies
A very good video on Vimeo called "Image v Substance in the Body of Christ" by Chris Roseborough made in connection with exposing Carl Lentz as a false preacher contains some very strong points and what the very foundation of what Carl Lentz´s preaching is based on. Some thoughts lifted from that video. Video at end of these thoughts courtesy Chris Roseborough.
Carl Lentz and the embracing of Celebrity Culture
The Carl Lentz approach is in a nutshell where the Greater Body of Christ has adopted the same values as in Celebrity Culture which are Image and Numerical Success as in followers, wealth, chart highs and sales etc, etc. If you are a celebrity then your ideas and views become important. Celebrities become celebrities by entertaining us and nothing more. The substance of celebrity lives doesn´t match up to the image that they try to artificially create as we have witnessed many times in their private lives. A large number of the new evangelicals have adopted the same celebrity mindset as the world and created an elite world of Celebrity Mega Preachers who are media savvy but their image does not add up to their Biblical substance. If you know your Bible and have just a slight Biblical Discernment, you will realise the Celebrity Pastors are no more than your normal celebrities, it´s all smoke and mirrors and nothing more.
Carl Lentz has a distinct image and his preaching caters to a specific market and that is New York Hipster types and is as far removed from the "Traditional Church" as you can get, people want to hear this stuff, they don´t want to hear sound doctrine any more. But here´s the problems
1. He doesn´t even meet the Biblical qualifications to be a pastor. The Bible disqualifies someone like Carl Lentz (See Vid below Image V Substance)
2. Lentz´s image is hipster and of "The World", and this image is very expensive to make and maintain and also just like in the Celebrity World has a short shelf life.
3. What qualifies somebody to preach as part of Jesus´s Church. Is it the image he projects or the substance of character and the doctrine he teaches?
4. There is no mention in the Bible that a Pastor has to portray a worldly image such as Carl Lentz in order to portray his message.
5. When interviewed by Katie Couric and asked about Joel Osteen he says he loves Joel, he states his message of hope is similar to ours. Joel Osteen is a false preacher so he is basically saying he is more of the same, but as he says "louder".
6. If Jesus didn´t mention about Homosexuality during his earthly ministry and people say that means that Jesus therefore is saying Homosexuality is not a problem. How about Incest and Paedophiles which were not mentioned either by Jesus....does that make that OK as well? You can see the reasoning here and this is a False Preacher tactic, to either twist what is there already or focus on things that were not mentioned and if they were not mentioned ....that must be OK then? Confusion is the realm of evil.
7. Carl Lentz is projecting the image of Christianity that people really want to see, the problem is the substance that backs up the image is false, will not lead you to Christ, in fact will probably lead you further away from the truth than somebody who is a non church goer or even a non believer!.
Titus 2:1. But speak thou the things which become sound doctrine:
My Observations on Carl Lentz
1. He reminds me of a Rock Star crossed with a Stand Up Comedian in a Comedy Club in his delivery and stance, preaching laced with hip humour, delivered fast and furious and whipping the audience into a frenzy with his energetic biblical? rap. Got to give it to him he is Charismatic.
2. He has been banned from preaching in Prison Institutions because he looks more like a criminal than a member of the cloth. That surely is not a good sign.
3. He get´s the masses into his club land style service and they probably leave buzzing with what they think is some sort of religious experience, but in reality, is that something that these people can build their own faith on, or is it dependant on next weeks sermon from Carl Lentz to top up this spiritual vaccuum that probably appears 24 hours later?
4. Your faith shouldn´t be based on a Pastor first and Jesus second it should be based on Jesus first and a Pastor way down the line if at all.
5. He has created an image but has no Biblical substance to back up this image that has been created..it´s simply tapping into the power of Celebrity Culture which is rampant in our society and applying it in a Religious environment. It´s blasphemy plain and simple.
6. Carl Lentz and his cool version of Christianity has been referred to as Christianity Light, Christianity without the heaviness. But take the heaviness away as in the real deal, and what are you left with..............not a lot.....what I call a lot of hot air, froth and foam. I liken it to having a quick intake of those helium gas miniature canisters, you will feeling good and will be laughing ecstatically for a couple of minutes and then it´s back to reality until the next canister. Is that the work of God or the Devil?
7. He states just like many other Prosperity Gospel preachers that Tithing is encouraged? Tithing is an Old Testament....Old Covenant model that was used back in the day and was like a Temple Tax. With the New Testament and Jesus came The New Covenant where Tithing was replaced by Giving as in Giving to the needy such as homeless, poor, hungry, the naked, old and infirm, orphans and widows. NOT giving to the rising wealthy, certainly not a church that is in the format of a nightclub/live music venue and people who are not in need and certainly not to people who are distorting the Gospel or creating a new one from the words that Jesus didn´t say.
8. He has a celebrity following which is a sort of Celebrity endorsement further reinforcing the Image over Substance Theory by Chris Rose Roseborough in his video Image over Substance in the Body of Christ.
9. Just like Joel Osteen when interviewed and asked a tricky question he´ll come out with evasive answers such as "that´s not something open to public debate" or other answers that skirt the issue.
10. A true Christian is not of the world and doesn´t follow wordly values, Carl Lentz is very much without a doubt a product of "The World" and not the product of an overwhelming faith in Jesus Christ "Saved" or otherwise.
11. All that aside, his manner is hyper and nervous the exact opposite of the "Peace" you will find in Christianity. He looks shifty, never gives a straight answer and the tattoos are the final trimmings to a package that screams something but it isn´t Christianity, and that´s his appeal and secret of his success. He talks about the narrow gate in one of his sermons, you will never find it with this man, I can guarantee it, but you will have a great time being led up the garden path to something, but it will not be God.
12. He states that Jesus lived in a time just like now where Homesexuality was rampant but he never addressed that issue, it is not mentioned in the New Testament. Carl Lentz is pushing this regarding Jesus and his views on Homesexuality and same sex marriage, it´s a False Teacher tactic. Perhaps the most common argument issues from silence: Jesus never mentions homosexuality or same-sex marriage; therefore, he must be for it. But this argument from silence presents another set of troubling conclusions. Namely, that whatever Jesus didn’t specifically address, he must endorse. Creating your own Gospel from silences is a False Gospel and a dangerous and False Preaching. The Bible clearly states many times that Homesexuality is a sin and an abomination. But the Bible also teaches that no sin is wider than Christ’s mercy if one will only repent and believe to be Saved. Anything outside of this is False Teaching and promoting Sin and Homesexuality. There is no getting away from that fact. This is why False Teachers don´t like answering this question because it´s a dead giveaway.
13. FINALLY: If what he teaches are distortions and twistings of the Gospel and the creation of New Gospels implied from what Jesus "didn´t say" then these are quite simply "deceptions" which are lies, and lies are the work of the Devil himself.
Summary
This is the fourth in the series of Mega Preachers Exposed and Carl Lentz is yet another variation but in a younger and more hip form of the Word of Faith and Prosperity Gospel movement. As you are starting to see, things are not clear cut initially when trying to fathom whether a Pastor is a false Preacher or not. He is not like Joel Osteen or Victoria Osteen, the current top of the pile amongst Mega Preachers or Celebrity Pastors, I would say he is more like Paula White, catering to a younger audience with in places an almost religious rap like quality infused with energy and lashings of the word Jesus and Love to make it sound all spiritual and Christian like.
The normal views on Fasting, Prayer and a look at his Testimony and his past have been thrown out the window here, there is no need to delve any deeper........... there really is no need!
This man though, is seriously on the rise to Celebrity Pastor and Mega Preacher fame, is appearing on a lot of TV Interviews and comes out just like Joel Osteen sort of smelling of Roses, any tricky questions that that could prove devastating to his image he just like the others will come out with some evasive politician style answer such as "we have a stance on love and everything else we have conversations" line? As Katie Couric stated in the interview "What does that mean". If you are a man of God you do not talk remotely like that, you speak the truth and you have nothing to hide.
The bottom line is though, this preacher hails from Hillsong so it is going to be more of the same, as in Heresy and a good excuse to mix Christianity with a Club like environment. Carl Lentz could be the next Joel Osteen, maybe not, but this kind of preaching is worrying not because of it´s rising popularity, that´s bad enough, but it´s where it leads people that is the problem. It confuses them, leads them away from Christ, when they think they are walking through the narrow gate, ultimately it can lead to a damaged faith, so much so ,they abandon what they think is Christianity, never to return. The other bizarre things is this, as always, these False Preachers are so sucked into the lie that they are preaching, they really believe that what they preaching is the real deal and that they are doing everybody an amazing service and they are utterly convinced that this is what Christianity is all about?
Bible Quotes:
On False Preachers and how to Preach
2 Timothy 2:15
15. Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
Meaning God want´s Pastors to teach sound and true doctrine and not to twist his words.
Titus 1:7-14
7. For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not selfwilled, not soon angry, not given to wine, no striker, not given to filthy lucre;
8. But a lover of hospitality, a lover of good men, sober, just, holy, temperate;
9. Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.
10. For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision:
11. Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre's sake.
12. One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, The Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies.
13. This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
14. Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.
2 Timothy 4:1-5
1. I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
2. Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
3. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
4. And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
5. But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.
2 Peter 2:1 (ESV) But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction.
Acts 20:29-31 (ESV) 29 I know that after my departure fierce wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock; 30 and from among your own selves will arise men speaking twisted things, to draw away the disciples after them. 31 Therefore be alert, remembering that for three years I did not cease night or day to admonish everyone with tears.
Matthew 24:24 (ESV) For false christs and false prophets will arise and perform great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect.
2 Corinthians 11:4 (ESV) For if someone comes and proclaims another Jesus than the one we proclaimed, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received, or if you accept a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it readily enough.
On Same Sex Marriage and Homosexuality
Eph. 5:31-32
32. This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
33. Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.
Matthew 19. In verses 4-6
4. And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
5. And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
6. Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
1 Timothy 1:8-10
8. But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
9. Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
10. For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
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